11 5 2019 IN THE HEART OF LUCIFER : GOOD BECAME EVIL AND EVIL BECOME GOOD .
Read the scripture then read the conversation about how evolution or creation to understand why there can be no compromise it leads to what was in the heart of lucifer and his decenent to the earth and the need for christ .
1 The word of the LORD came again unto me, saying,
2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:
3 Behold, thou art wiser than Daniel; there is no secret that they can hide from thee:
4 With thy wisdom and with thine understanding thou hast gotten thee riches, and hast gotten gold and silver into thy treasures:
5 By thy great wisdom and by thy traffick hast thou increased thy riches, and thine heart is lifted up because of thy riches:
6 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thou hast set thine heart as the heart of God;
7 Behold, therefore I will bring strangers upon thee, the terrible of the nations: and they shall draw their swords against the beauty of thy wisdom, and they shall defile thy brightness.
8 They shall bring thee down to the pit, and thou shalt die the deaths of them that are slain in the midst of the seas.
9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.
10 Thou shalt die the deaths of the uncircumcised by the hand of strangers: for I have spoken it, saith the Lord GOD.
11 Moreover the word of the LORD came unto me, saying,
12 Son of man, take up a lamentation upon the king of Tyrus, and say unto him, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Thou sealest up the sum, full of wisdom, and perfect in beauty.
13 Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone was thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created.
14 Thou art the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee so: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire.
15 Thou wast perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee.
16 By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire.
17 Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee.
18 Thou hast defiled thy sanctuaries by the multitude of thine iniquities, by the iniquity of thy traffick; therefore will I bring forth a fire from the midst of thee, it shall devour thee, and I will bring thee to ashes upon the earth in the sight of all them that behold thee.
19 All they that know thee among the people shall be astonished at thee: thou shalt be a terror, and never shalt thou be any more.
Isaiah 14:1-20 King James Version (KJV)
2 And the people shall take them, and bring them to their place: and the house of Israel shall possess them in the land of the Lord for servants and handmaids: and they shall take them captives, whose captives they were; and they shall rule over their oppressors.
9 Hell from beneath is moved for thee to meet thee at thy coming: it stirreth up the dead for thee, even all the chief ones of the earth; it hath raised up from their thrones all the kings of the nations.
19 But thou art cast out of thy grave like an abominable branch, and as the raiment of those that are slain, thrust through with a sword, that go down to the stones of the pit; as a carcase trodden under feet.
Genesis 3 King James Version (KJV)
6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
14 And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:
17 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life;
Revelation 12 King James Version (KJV)
4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.
14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
A CONVERSATION OF HOW THERE CAN ONLY BE A PURELY NATURALIST OR CREATIONIST.
Again, you start making all sorts of different claims which confuse the discussion. Please stop doing that. As I said before, I am not going to discuss several different things at the same time. I tried to do this, but what happened was that you started to ignore the original topic. In fact, you are still doing that. I find this very frustrating and frankly I'm close to giving up on this discussion out of pure frustration with how you keep ignoring what I am saying. Also, you again repeat your old argument. Are you a parrot???? Just to be clear: I'm not defending a purely naturalistic worldview here. That is a separate discussion. I am trying to focus on one specific point. After we have figured out that issue, we can move on to (for example) debating evolution itself. The only thing I am saying, and have been saying again and again, and which you haven't disproven, is that the truth of evolution can be scientifically debated without having to answer the question of whether abiogenesis occurred. Evolution can have happened after a deity created life. I'm not saying one did, I'm just saying it is possible to debate such a possibility. In fact, there are lots of Christians who believe that God created the first life and then guided evolution in such a way that humans eventually came about. It is not my view, but it is a view that is logically consistent. Also, your mentioning of your "evidence" against evolution means that you are currently trying to have such the debate which you have been saying is not possible. If you can agree with me on this point, we can then go on to debate (for example) evolution itself. If you can't agree with this point, I must come to the conclusion that you don't really understand what I have been trying to say again and again. If you don't really understand me, just say so, because it certainly seems that way. Please don't hide behind changing the topic or saying the same thing again and again. It suggests that you can't really focus on debating a single topic.
Diedert Spijkerboer you said ' Again, you start making all sorts of different claims which confuse the discussion. Please stop doing that. As I said before, I am not going to discuss several different things at the same time. '
YOU SCOPE OF EVOLUTION OF NATURALIST WORLDVIEW AGAINTS MY BROADER SCOPE OF NATURLAIST WORLD VIEW .
i am trying to disprove evolution . evolution is at the heart of naturalist worldview i am talking about the wide scope of things while you want to narrow scope to evolution alone . evolution was the starting point then came the big bang theory came and expanded the naturalist world view . so i believe if i take out the foundation the whole naturalist worldview will collapse which is contrary to creationist world view. so when we talk about creation vs evolution its the biblical worldview vs the naturalist worldviews to me this spiritual warfare . inequalities vs equalities (for there are ultimatly 2 doctrines GOD's TRUTH vs the LIE OF SATAN (creation corruption of the truth (GODS LAW) like the pharisee traditions of men which twisted it )
. i wrote a whole thesis about this there is the truth that comes from GOD and corruption of that TRUTH .
you said ' Also, you again repeat your old argument. Are you a parrot???? Just to be clear: I'm not defending a purely naturalistic worldview here. That is a separate discussion. I am trying to focus on one specific point. After we have figured out that issue, we can move on to (for example) debating evolution itself. '
IT IS EITHER CREATION OR NATURALISM . THE CREATION NARRTIVE HINGES ON THE SIN IN THE GARDEN . ( SETTING THE STAGE ORGIN OF SIN AND THE CAUSE OF FALL AND THE INEQUALITES BETWEEN GOD AND CREATION VS THE EQUALIST BETWEEN GOD AND CREATION ).
there is only two narratives creation or naturalism . a omnipotent , omniscience , omnibenovlanet , life in himself (self suffcient ) being created the cosmo and the earth in 7 actual days . then lucifer posed the question of equality between creation and creator is there equalitty between creation and creator ( also known as gender equality)? Are there natures the same and are equal ? is creation femmine nature possing of all postive attributes as like GOD ? . ya see lucifer reason was over come by his emotion and based on emotion not truth which is GOD's word he saw his beuaty and began to see his beauty rival that of GOD and came to believe that he was equal a lie based on emotion . a lie a diviation from the truth of GOD and twisted it seeing good as evil and evil as good believing the unequal relationshio between creation and creator are equal and seeing the unequal relationship between him and GOD not as his father his Shepard( a mutually beneficial relationship cooperative relationship) but as a oppressor and that creation is oppressed oppressor dynamic thinking he was correcting a wrong and doing a good thing but in reality was doing evil he thought GOD was oppressing him when in reality he was sustaining him but Lucifer wanted GOD to give up authority to allow him to rule in GOD place disregarding the fact GOD was sustaining him and gave him all the good things that made him think he was equal to GOD .. so LORD GOD was attacked by lucifer so GOD relinquished responsibility for him and Lucifer and his angels who joined his cause came down to the earth and the very choice the angels were given was given to us and same temptation to autonomony instead of subordinate to GOD and Adam . satan tempted eve and she gave in to temptation sin and lead Adam to sin . How GOD ordained the relationship the man love the woman and she obey him . Eve rebelling against Adam denied Adam of his authority which is compensation for his budren of responsibility where the relationship turned from cooperative relation of mutual interest to that self interest where they fight for domiance over each other violating the heart of GOD's law . You shall love the lORD GOD with all heart soul and strength and love other as yourself what was natural to us to do but we inverted the law which was in us when we rebelled . So now two contrary forces are in us the law of GOD and law of the flesh the inversion of the law of GOD .
The the KINGDOM of darkness the inversion of the kingdom of GOD was established on the earth . Lucifer the temrory ruler of the earth until GOD takes back the earth .
(READ THIS TO UNDERSTAND THIS WORLD .
WHY THE WORLD IS WAY IT IS . THE KINGDOM OF DARKNES ON EARTH AND KINGDOM OF LIGHT IN HEAVEN .
created being such as humans, animals ,angels are created being they cannot exists outside of relationship with GOD or they will die . as like the relationship between GOD and creation is described as between a man and woman or parent and child .
How the relationship between the parent and child or man and woman work.
woman are to submit to the authority (obey to hear and do his commands ) of there husband and men love ( authority and responsibility over her ) your wife for cooperation between men and woman occurs when they respect each others role a man has authority and responsibility for te woman the woman obeys her husbands commands she does as she is told .anyway this cooperation and both mutually beneficial from this but when you try to make woman and men equal in which both are fundamentally unequal it turns to oppressors oppressed relationship a relationship of competition from serving each other to serving yourself and either the man or the woman will be oppressed .if the man has responsibility and not authority she is oppressing him and him oppresd if he authority but no responsibility he is oppressing her . that is why equality between men and woman is satanic because it is toxic producing a relationship from cooperation to comepetion and one lives richly while the other suffers but both are miserable . The relationship shown between adam and eve Is symbolic of relation between GOD and creation he loves us and creation obeys him os when they disobeyed GOD and deviated from what GOD had ordained the relationship between men and woman so as adam and eve deviated from GOD will they rebelled against GOD as eve against adam . This is what broke the relationship between GOD and creation. So that is why LORD GOD serperated himself from us at the garden because if he remained he would remanin in a toxic relationship and he rremoved himself for he will not be oppressed or opress so we were seprated and because LORD GOD is incorruptable he cannot remain for he cannot go againts his nature and allow himself eithet to be a opressorr or oppressed hencforth seperation and as he gave life so he shall take it away as you have rejected him so he will in turn reject you .
in the garden GOD created woman for the man she is made to have relationship with him and if she defies her purpose ( role in the relationship ) it breaks the relationship and separation will occur so from nothingness she comes from nothing she and she returns to nothing that is what should have happened in the garden Adam to reject eve and she would have been destroyed and him saved as she rebelled . For she is to obey Adam as unto the LORD GOD but she rebelled against GOD and Adam and this she broke her relationship with GOD . For creations obeys ( hear and does his commands ) GOD and GOD loves ( authority and responsibility )his creation .
Satan lie is a lie of equality . Lucifer doctrine at a heart of it is of equality between God and creation their natures are the same
he rejected the knowledge of GOD and acted based on his emotion not truth he went against the feminine nature ( dependent ( not self sufficient ) , limited knowledge , limited power etc ) of creation which absence of positive attributes of the creator masculine nature ( life in himself (self sufficient , omniscient , omnipresence , omnipotent etc ) GOD , .
when you rebel what GOD has ordained you have rejected GOD authority and neither will he responsible and separation occurs and as he was sustaining us we fall in to desoulation and die . This is cause of the fall .
The wraith of GOD is due on us along with satan for his rebellion and by drawing us to conflict he has extended his life but also rule over the earth . Him and his angels are doomed but adam and eve were given a promises from GOD to reconcile them to him by sparing them the wraith due on to them by slaying a lamb and going back into good standing with GOD and eternal life with GOD in kingdom of GOD .
. the absence if creation 7 days
so to repeat YOU SAID ' Also, you again repeat your old argument. Are you a parrot???? Just to be clear: I'm not defending a purely naturalistic worldview here. That is a separate discussion. I am trying to focus on one specific point. After we have figured out that issue, we can move on to (for example) debating evolution itself. The only thing I am saying, and have been saying again and again, and which you haven't disproven, is that the truth of evolution can be scientifically debated without having to answer the question of whether abiogenesis occurred. Evolution can have happened after a deity created life. I'm not saying one did, I'm just saying it is possible to debate such a possibility. In fact, there are lots of Christians who believe that God created the first life and then guided evolution in such a way that humans eventually came about. It is not my view, but it is a view that is logically consistent. '
MY RESPONSE .
there cannot be compromise between creationism and evolution simple as that if LORD GOD doctrine is true you do not lean on you own understanding but only trust his word . For GOD masculine nature is fundamentally opposite of creation ( humans , angels , animals )so as creation has limted knowledge while GOD knowledge is unlimited . Can a 5 $ calculator do the immesurable computation of of $1 trillion super computer ? . no it can't .so we trust the biblical account as written and what was spoken by GOD . secondly LORD GOD is omnipotent and omniscience he merely commands and it occurs as with cosmos . so creating physical bodies is nothing and breath the breath of life into is bring all things to life thats how garden and all things with the breath of life came to be . Then the relationship of unequals is broken and need to reconcile it via Christ the whole Christian narrative collapses without creation and creator being unequal and trying to make equal two unequal this broke that relationship. So without it there is no broken relationship . The broken relationship it did not bring death and misery but has always exsited why do we need a sacrifice to statify the wraith of GOD so we can be reconciled to GOD ? . so GOD is not a omnibenovlant being but is corruptible and equal to creation or we are self sustained and always exsitsed . So it is either one of the two because either we ourseleves created and are center of universe as GOD or we are not and he Is fundementally ooposite of us and he created the world in 7 days and sinned and need christ to reconcile us on to GOD to eternity ..
anyway if we equal to GOD we would self sufficent as GOD .
John 5:24-29 King James Version (KJV)
this is not true we are dying and the world is agony so clearly we are not so why is their life to begin with if the whole world is dying lncluding us ? And the whole cosmos is heading to heat death ? . so if we are self sustained be would not be dying but if there is life on here on this planet . there must be source someone must have it and gave us life and sustained us and now we are not being sutained by him and fallen In desolation .so if that is case christ will remove reconcile us via christ the wraith of GOD goes on christ and right we inheirt through faith in JESUS and from the faith comes forth works being christ like and as jacob imited esau and inheirted the right we christian imiate christ we inheirt the right . GOD will be our father we will love us he has authoirty over us and is responsible and we obey him . Being in relationship with him on to eternity . So without rebellion in the garden there is not need for christ to reconcile us to GOD . If that was the case we would content eating drinking forncation but we are not so our purpose is beyond and that is to be in relationship with GOD on to eternity as eve was intended to be inrelationship with GOD forever ..